Kudos to Galaxy

[FredFriendly]

This pretty much says it all: http://www.uticaod.com/homepage/x1151558566

Congratulations to everyone that made such a quick turn-around in the ratings. WOUR is well on it's way to reclaiming it's throne and I, along with everyone else, like what I'm hearing...now that there's a new Doctor handling the case it was just a matter of time till the patient recovered from it's long, sad decline.

The story with MIX is just as exciting. After years of shoddy programming at the hands of incompetents it was inevitable that the kind of results we're seeing now would happen..here's hoping that Twinkletoes and Roadkilled fully appreciate just how much these numbers reflect on their humiliating inability..good luck on your future careers in "retail management".

As for The Toupee's "he'll be pulling double digits!" prediction...LOL. Anyone that's seen the numbers knows that the market is tired of old, washed up personalities, much less has-beens endlessly flogging nickel and dime high school sports. So sad, try again.

 

[hokeypokey]

Thanks Ed. Was this artibron or eastlan numbers. Amazing what one can do with no River or Rock 107 on air. Where else do they go. Your bragging is useless. As for MIX what did you do besides play holiday music? Anyone can program that. I am sure the people you mention would rather work their other jobs than have to wash the jag. Nothing like making $20,000 in Utica, NY. Way to go Ed.

 

[SirRoxalot]

Ratings? What Ratings?

Got a link to actual numbers? Even 12+ numbers?

Or are we supposed to take YOUR word for it...

 

[Osama]

And who was the doctor that took care of the Bone for you in Albany??? Kevorkian????

 

[ChiaHead]

Apparently all the Utica stations formerly owned by Clear Channels did very well.The Roser station Kiss is number 3 in the market overall with a 7.4 share.The O-D reported today that WOUR went 5.9-8.0 in 25-54.Plus "Chrismix" went crazy in the ratings too.Those nitwits at Galaxy and Roser either got lucky or the people running CC in Utica were REALLY dumb.
Or both!

 

[hokeypokey]

Interesting. KISS staff is still the same. MIX had Christmix music help and remember with no River and Rock 107 to take 25-54 WOUR had no place to go but up.

 

[ChiaHead]

Good points! Some posters had thought that WXUR would make a move with Keller but that station did nothing ,below a 2 share overall.
Now that there is a good morning show on with Imus,maybe they will do better or at least above a 2.

 

[Shirley]

I listened to Day One of the Gomez & Dave broadcast today on WOUR as they took over for Bob & Tom. Calls with comedians Mike Virbiglea and Howie Mandel. ESPN's Kenny Mayne live in AZ for the Super Bowel. Pretty good for Utica. Flipped over to their main station in Syracuse and they weren't simulcasting, though. So I don't know what was up with that. Maybe just a one day thing. Either way, a fairly smooth and entertaining show. And I'm rooting for someone else other than "the big bad syndicated show from Clear Channel" to succeed.

 

[BobRoss]

KISS staff is still the same.

KISS staff is the same, but it's probably a matter of morale and management. Hard to be motivated to do great work when you're sitting around KNOWING your owner is looking to dump the property, and you have no idea if you'll still have a job when the deed changes hands.

Not to mention, the poor job management was doing. Not so much local management -- who's performance was likely severely restricted by higher-ups -- but the regional and national managers who swapped out live nights and weekends for things like Carson Daly or voicetracking. The national managers who killed local contesting in favor of national contesting that most listeners are too smart to believe.

I'm gonna get deep here, but I think more than any other format, CHR has the greatest need to be live and local. Why? Who listens to CHR? Mostly younger adults, teens, kids. If you can't get 'em hooked on the radio early in life, how do you expect to keep them around when they become old enough to "graduate" over to your money-demo-fueled AC or country stations? When I was around 10-14, I remember hearing "Goodnight Kisses" every night... you'd listen to see if they mentioned anyone you knew. Or you'd call in and be a "guest DJ" for the top 8 at 8. When there isn't a feature like that on, teens and young adults are still likely to call and ask about songs they're hearing, or to request songs. Even if you have no intention of playing those requests (or they're already on the log to begin with), having someone there to say "yeah, we'll try" is so much better than letting people down with a non-stop ring, a busy signal, or even an answering machine. When you let people down with the feeling they have no "connection" to the station, that's when they start feeling betrayed.

with no River and Rock 107 to take 25-54 WOUR had no place to go but up.

It's likely a LOT of stations went up because of the River's and Rock 107's disappearance. Besides WOUR being the big winner there, I would guess WODZ, WXUR and maybe even WLZW all had chances to pick up a few listeners. That's like how one supermarket in town goes out of business and all the others pick up more business. It's not entirely because the other supermarkets did a better job -- it's just because the shoppers have fewer choices.

 

[Adman4120]

Hello Bob Ross and Everyone...Bob, I consider you to be very knowledgeable of this business and I enjoy reading your comments. I am sure sure will understand and agree on a few of my points here.

Without giving away numbers from Arbitron, let me say again that I wish Ed Levine and Galaxy the best. Ed has always treated my clients with respect and has always gone the extra mile to help them get results. We may not agree with everything, but everyone has the right to express their opinions.

There is no doubt that WOUR went up, but not that much yet. I expect a larger increase next book since Galaxy has finally settled in on their music choice and has chosen to go with Gomez & Dave in the morning and drop Bob & Tom. I think Gomez & Dave do a heck of a job, and trust they will connect with the Utica/Rome listeners.

MIX 102.5 did go up and Galaxy got a lot of press. However, my concern is that the fall book and the increase numbers for MIX, had nothing to do with the fall book. 40% of the fall book was taken with Clear Channel running things and Linda Rae programming the music, while the other 60% of the book was taken when MIX was playing 24/7 Christmas music. MIX and Galaxy switched to their current music format after Christmas and after the book was over. So, no one knows if the music and delivery they are currently implementing, will maintain those fall book numbers. They could maintain them, they could go up, they could free fall and go down. Remember, many people that listen to Christmas music do spike a stations numbers, but then, many of those same people switch away. I'm eager to try MIX and just hope Galaxy promotes it enough around town so people give it a listen, then decide if they like it or not.

With all the hype of MIX, let it be known that LITE 98.7 actually went up even more than the last book when they were on top, especially in women!! Some are trying to imply they dropped and have become boring etc. That might be true, but the numbers do not indicate that. Yes, Lite 98.7 went down, but ONLY in the 7-PM-midnight time slot with Delila. We all know that most advertisers do not care as much about 7 till midnight. And yes, if you take the four day parts with 7 till midnight included Lite 98.7 did go down because they dropped so much from 7 till midnight. But if you look at 6-AM-7-PM or any separate dayparts between 6-AM-7-PM, you will find substantial increases from even the last book which is unheard of. So, LITE did just fine. Double and and slightly more than double the female audience of MIX. It will be be very interesting to see how both fare after the Spring book.

Frog was down some, WODZ was up substantially from last book, KISS did fine in their main demos. Always nice to look at the 10-year old age brackets versus the wide demos of 25-49 or 25-54, etc. You know for sure how a station is doing when you look at the 10-year old age brackets. Only Frog and LITE showed consistent audience shares in all 10-year age brackets, while all other stations did well in just one or two 10-year old age cells.

 

[Element9]

Now that there is a good morning show on with Imus, maybe they will do better or at least above a 2.

Imus may be good in the context of morning competition in Utica-Rome, but frankly, his show sucks. Same old slurring near-70 misanthrope who can't bring it. WABC's bold $5 million a year investment may not make the cut in the Big Apple.

...WODZ was up substantially from last book...

Guess they don't miss Nick Caplan. Feh!

now that there's a new Doctor handling the case it was just a matter of time till the patient recovered from it's long, sad decline.

In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king.

Thanks for shedding some well-reasoned light on the real Utica-Rome numbers, Adman. It seems that the Lite AC's that went All Christmas performed better (head to head) than the Hot AC's the went All Christmas in those markets. This certainly was the case in Philly, Houston, Rochester and Buffalo.

It will be interesting to monitor the residual effect of All Christmas, which affects the first month of the Winter (Jan-Feb-Mar) book. By the time the 2nd and 3rd phases hit, the residual effect subsides as the cume slides and the TSL returns to normal.

There's also a case to be made for All Christmas being an actual format change. Great for advertisers who are on during November and December, not so great for clients who miss the uptick and get on board in February or March. Of course, those Christmas numbers do wonders for Four-Book-Averages that so many sales people love.

From what i've read, PPM markets are showing that radio is substantially cume driven, but not necessarily strongest in morning drive, although AM drive is not to be discounted by any means.

-9-

 

[BobRoss]

It will be interesting to monitor the residual effect of All Christmas, which affects the first month of the Winter (Jan-Feb-Mar) book. By the time the 2nd and 3rd phases hit, the residual effect subsides as the cume slides and the TSL returns to normal.

Unfortunately, U-R only does two books a year, so the all-Christmas gimmick only reflects in the last half of the fall book. Unless Eastlan is offering to do four books a year (and they very well may be)... but as we've discussed before, Eastlan can only benefit Galaxy's own local sales reps. National buys are still done by the Arbs.

Still, all-Christmas is usually a good strategy for the "lagging" AC in a market to try to pick up some new ears -- though I often wonder if they wind up alienating any P1's in the process. Not everyone wants to hear non-stop Christmas music. I use myself as an example: I like Christmas music, but not for hours on end. Lite's always done a decent job at defending against all-Christmas by sprinkling the holiday tunes in amongst their regular playlist. Although some folks will switch to Mix to hear the holiday tunes, I'd bet a number of pre-Christmas P1's were turned off. And just like the hope is that you'll keep those Christmas listeners for awhile... pre-Christmas P1's who go away may never come back.

Then again, for all we know, the all-Christmas on Mix could have been a one-time thing so Galaxy would have plenty of time to change format clocks, playlists, install the new jingles, and so forth.

Hello Bob Ross and Everyone...Bob, I consider you to be very knowledgeable of this business and I enjoy reading your comments. I am sure sure will understand and agree on a few of my points here.

Same here -- as I've mentioned in previous threads, I like these kinds of conversations much better than the pointless rock station vs. rock station threads that used to be much more frequent here.

LITE 98.7 actually went up even more than the last book when they were on top, especially in women!! Some are trying to imply they dropped and have become boring etc. That might be true, but the numbers do not indicate that. Yes, Lite 98.7 went down, but ONLY in the 7-PM-midnight time slot with Delilah.

Interesting. Didn't Lite take the all-Christmas version of Delilah this year? I'm not near a radio between 7-Mid too often these days, but the few times I did have the chance to listen, I thought it was all-Christmas. Perhaps they did wind up alienating those listeners who don't want to hear non-stop holiday tunes. I'd be interested to see if Mix's numbers went up in the same timeslot. If they did, maybe the Tesh show is starting to gain some ground. Even though they're both syndicated, Tesh at least offers "useful" information. Delilah is just the same old sappy "destress your day" spiel every night, with love song requests from people calling in from anywhere but here. Lite could probably kick butt if they ever put a local jock back on that shift.

It will be be very interesting to see how both fare after the Spring book.

Indeed. When Mix was a Hot AC, they actually had a good format to "bridge the gap," so to speak, between the younger KISS audience and the older Lite audience. But that was about it. I never saw Mix as a real contender against Lite, because Mix had a handful of titles that were either too hot (borderline or even fully CHR) or too obscure to really pass the "dentist's office test." Some of Lite's music may be boring, but the reason AC stations are so popular "at work" is because they always fit in as background music in almost any situation where you might have people of all ages listening -- and there are songs all of those people can recognize. If you go Hot AC, you usually center on just the 90s and today (maybe the 80s), and that might alienate 40+ listeners.

Now that Mix is going more directly head-to-head against Lite, there could be some sparks flying. Galaxy will probably be more competitive going mainstream AC than they could be with hot AC. Lite's longtime motto of "Less Talk" seems more like a joke, considering Mix is now playing the same music, and it's jockless most of the time. If Galaxy is willing to give Mix some decent, long-term promotional attention, they could really pull a coup. The key being "long-term." You can't promote the heck out of it for 3 months and then just back off, a la Clear Channel. It takes a lot longer than 3 months for a new station to put a serious dent into a heritage leader. And it takes even longer to turn that dent into a complete victory. It takes a staff (and management) who can accept the fact they will not be victorious in one book, or even one year... but they COULD be victorious eventually, as long as they put up a good effort, and keep at it for at least a few years.

On a side note -- one other area where Mix and Lite are equal: They both have new jingles, and both sets are AWFUL. Lite's old jingles were way better than the ones they're airing now. Mix's new jingles clearly show there's been a change in the format (no more of those annoying 2-voice liners where the man and woman just repeat each other), but that "one-oh-two-point-fiiiiiiiive" jingle is terrible.

 

[Element9]

AC wars are hard fought. Much like Country, the heritage station has the advantage and it's often the case that what the heritage station does NOT do often affects the battle as much as what the challenger DOES. In other words, if you're the GM/PD/SM of the heritage AC, it's important NOT to react to the challenger.

Certainly important not to OVER-REACT. Don't add hot AC songs, don't drastically adjust the music rotations. Stay the course, stay with what's worked, stay focused on the mission and the P-1's who love your station and continue to promote heavily.

Bob mentioned Lite's new jingle package and how much better the old Lite package sounded. This is telling. There are so many ways to refresh the imaging without going to new jingles. You don't throw the baby out with the bath water.

A good example is what happened in NYC when Clear Channel's Lite-FM, the market's long time leading AC station, got weak knees when CBS went hot AC with 102.7 Fresh FM. Lite 106.7 modified its image to "New York FM." That lasted a few months, Clear Channel came to its senses and reverted to Lite-FM.

If Lite-FM is leading the pack in Utica-Rome and has any sense at all, they'll stay the course and stay very cool. Ed likes to play head games with his competitors. He's a shrewd guy but he thinks he's Patton. Half his problem is his massive ego. Study martial arts, psychology and the dynamics of competitive and successful businesses and you'll find that it's best to leave your ego and emotions at the door. Granted, not the easiest thing to do in the heat of battle, but it's essential for success.

In Buffalo, there's a three way brawl for AC. The established stations are Lite Rock Favorites (Regent) and Hot AC (Entercom.) The newbee is Mix (Citadel.) The only daypart that matters on all three stations at this point is middays, where it's an all out brawl with established live air personalities, good features and well-researched music on all three stations. So what might make the difference? Promotion. Positive attitude. Localism. Attention to detail.

If the newbee can crack the armor of the two established AC's, it will probably happen first in middays where the at-work TSL is immense. It's the tipping point of all AC's. Next critical daypart would be PM drive. Then mornings. Ideally, you'd WANT mornings to be the first daypart to break the armor, but it doesn't often work that way, especially in AC... unless of course, the AC challenger has the rare good fortune to hire the morning team from the established AC.

Since it's a two book per year market there's no Winter book in Utica-Rome, it will be interesting to see if Mix can carry the All Christmas Music mo' through the Spring book. Sounds like this battle for ears will be fought in businesses, car dealerships and offices throughout the Mohawk Valley. It's a small market. If I were Lite, my hishest profile jocks and/or morning show would be going door to door in the hottest AC zip codes and every business establishment. Like a political campaign. Wear comfortable shoes and wear 'em out.

-9-

 

[Adman4120]

Hello Element and Bob...I will examine and see how MIX did from 7-PM-Midnight during the holiday season compared to Lite. As we know, Lite took a huge hit 7 till midnight. I did not look at 7 till midnight from MIX.

It is hard to believe that Lite has been on or near the top for 17-years, while FROG, also in the same position, celebrated their 20th anniversary on February 1st. Matt Herkimer is the only original FROG on air talent who also celebrated 20-years the other day.

Yes, it will be very interesting to see how Lite and MIX do against one another. While there are only two books in this market, there still is nothing signed for Eastlan to survey Utica/Rome. I believe they are doing Syracuse.

There is no doubt that ED knows how to get publicity for his stations even if it really isn't anything big. That is where the other groups fall asleep. When Galaxy got Utica OD headlines about WOUR going up and MIX going up, Regent should have already had a phone call in to tell the OD that they were still the leader for the 17th year in a row and went up even more. That would have showed that the Galaxy hype was nothing and the MIX increase had nothing to do with the fall ratings book.

Obviously MIX is going after Lite. From what I have heard, MIX is very intense with female artists/groups, playing many female songs back to back. I am wondering if that is the solution. Even females get tired of hearing so many female songs in a row.

If Galaxy promotes as both of you pointed out, they have an excellent opportunity to erode the Lite audience. This market hasn't seen much in the way of competition for about 20-years. Maybe this will be the start and will make radio as a whole work harder and sound better in this area. But, if history repeats itself and MIX and WOUR just track from Syracuse or even Utica, will that still help them to succeed?

Great on-going conversation ahead for this board.

 

[BobRoss]

Yes, it will be very interesting to see how Lite and MIX do against one another. While there are only two books in this market, there still is nothing signed for Eastlan to survey Utica/Rome. I believe they are doing Syracuse.

I don't want to nitpick, but I believe Eastlan IS doing Utica-Rome for Galaxy. Recent articles on several trade websites recently reported Eastlan had added Newburgh-Middletown as their third market in New York, following Syracuse and Utica-Rome. A press release on Eastlan's website pretty much says the same thing.

There is no doubt that ED knows how to get publicity for his stations even if it really isn't anything big. That is where the other groups fall asleep. When Galaxy got Utica OD headlines about WOUR going up and MIX going up, Regent should have already had a phone call in to tell the OD that they were still the leader for the 17th year in a row and went up even more. That would have showed that the Galaxy hype was nothing and the MIX increase had nothing to do with the fall ratings book.

A great point. Many times, a simple press release is all it takes to create a story, especially on a slow news day. I'm actually surprised the OD didn't include Regent's response -- they usually are better at presenting both sides. Perhaps under their new management, this story went to a rookie who just accepted the press release without question, and "forgot" to check in with the other stations in town. Or, maybe when Regent was contacted, they went on about how Eastlan and Arbitron are two entirely different ballgames... and it confused the reporter to the point where Regent's argument was simply left out. After all, Arbitron has said it's "revenge solution" against Ed in Syracuse is to simply leave Galaxy stations out of the book entirely -- so even the national agencies can't see his numbers. If they're doing the same in Utica-Rome, is there really any way for Regent (or ANY competitor for that matter) to dispute the numbers? How can you compare apples to oranges, when (a) you don't know how many apples (Arb points) they have, and (b) you don't know how many oranges (Eastlan points) you have?

Not saying either possibility even comes CLOSE to excusing the reporter from including the competitors, but many papers these days lack a "broadcasting-savvy" person who is knowledgeable enough to report on things like ratings, without getting fooled by the same number-twisting the sales reps try to use on their clients. Heck, there are even people in the business who get confused when they look at the numbers.

If Galaxy promotes as both of you pointed out, they have an excellent opportunity to erode the Lite audience. This market hasn't seen much in the way of competition for about 20-years. Maybe this will be the start and will make radio as a whole work harder and sound better in this area. But, if history repeats itself and MIX and WOUR just track from Syracuse or even Utica, will that still help them to succeed?

I think they key question here is: how long is Ed willing to stay in the battle? Look back into history. There was a time when KG104 was dominant, and Lite 98.7 was barely a blip on the radar. It took some time, but eventually Lite came out ahead and KG went belly-up. Any competitor has the chance to do that again -- it's a matter of how long they're willing to put up a fight. The first Mix had a chance, but Clear Channel failed to keep up a strong promotional front. I have it on good authority that insiders at Regent were pretty concerned when CC flipped Bob to Mix. Luckily for them, CC approached the launch as a sprint, rather than a distance run. Lots of oomph out of the gate, but when overnight success didn't happen, their efforts lessened considerably.

Mix could be successful IF Ed Levine accepts the fact that it could take a long time for Mix to chisel away at Lite. It will take more than a few books. It will likely take more than a few years. If Ed expects big results quickly like Clear Channel did, he's going to be very disappointed. If he hires air talent and only gives them one year to beat Lite, those folks will be looking for new jobs in a year. Taking over a heritage station is something that requires a lot of time and money.

As Element9 mentioned, the only way Ed could score an instant coup would be to steal away Lite's entire weekday airstaff. It would be pretty expensive up-front, but it would payoff almost immediately. Despite any opinions about the personalities... just the maneuver itself would virtually cripple Lite. Check their music list on R&R's website -- the morning guy is the MD, and the afternoon guy is the PD. Losing those two at the same time would practically cripple the station, leaving the OM or a consultant to generate music logs and handle day-to-day programming. Not to mention, the hassle of conducting searches for all three positions -- all the while, their established former airstaff is already working across town. The move would definitely generate enough press to get people to notice and change the dial.

The only downside: the "immediate" payoff wouldn't be so immediate. Because U-R is a two-book market, there are no Arbitrends to immediately reflect the impact (and again, Ed's not using Arbitron). If Ed pulled such a move right before the spring book started in April, the impact wouldn't be known until July or early August. It would almost definitely work out well in the end, but I don't know if Ed has the resources to make the initial investment of hiring three jocks (at salaries higher than whatever Lite's paying) and pay those salaries for however long it takes before fresh ratings numbers allow Ed to begin charging higher rates and becoming profitable. Also, you're dealing with diaries... it's anyone's guess how many listeners would write down Lite out of habit, giving Lite credit that should have been given to Mix. (This is where a lot would ride on Arbitron properly crediting any mentions of air talent by name, and we all know Arbitron's not looking to do Galaxy any favors these days.)

None of this would probably ever happen, but it would sure be neat to sit back and watch how things unfold if it did.

 

[ChiaHead]

Re: Kudos to Galaxy Also In Syracuse

Presented for discussion purposes- Syracuse Fall
12+
1)B104
2)TK99
3)WSYR
25-54
1)B104
2)TK99
3)93Q
18-34
1)Hot 107
2)K-Rock
3)B104
Others of note: 95X-3.1 12+. MOVIN '2.0 12+

 

[SirRoxalot]

Rank

Thanks for the rankings, but are those Eastlan rankings or Arbitron rankings?

 

[ChiaHead]

What's an "Eastlan"?

 

[ThePickleReport]

Re: Kudos to Galaxy Also In Syracuse

Wow. I can't believe they haven't attempted to stop the bleeding there. They did recently trade-in their hideous website for a new design though.

 

[Radknowski]

Wow. I can't believe they haven't attempted to stop the bleeding there. They did recently trade-in their hideous website for a new design though.

Are you kidding me? They've gone through three gallons of "O+" and there's no end in sight!

But seriously, is that "-" sign meant to indicate the stationis DOWN 3.1 or is it simply a hyphen? Either way, it's not good. Clarification, s'il vous plaît.