Mimi Chen joins The Sound tonight

[djmimi]

Regardless of how KSCA did in whatever demo you bring up, this station The Sound is dramatically different. The playlist is very different, KSCA didn't have the same library cuts. So it's really like comparing apples and oranges. Believe it or not, one AAA station is not the same as another (esp when they are appearing ten years apart in a market that is quite different than what it used to be)
This is why there is no predictability in radio. It's almost like stock picking. If we were able to predict how a particular stock is going to do (some are more predictable than others, true), then we'd all be millionaires. Same goes for radio. Ah, if I could only afford 3 million to have lunch with Warren Buffett (someone paid 2.1 million to do just that)!!
I was talking about Movin' the other day with a friend and how it sounded as if they plowed some money into research, and how they are failing big time with all that research...wow think of how much money they lost.
Programming being what it is - research vs. gut, I have seen both do equally well.

 

[goriajk]

Meems, good point through and through. David is looking at 12+ - and it's not fair. Simple as that. He's looking at numbers, but we're looking at audience loyality and QUALITY. That one share that's loyal will listen through those commericals. I did while Ch. 103 was on air. On KSWD, I've 'grinned and beared' the commercial breaks, although they are mostly short breaks. I've turned off my Sirius for the most part since April 8th, and for the critics who would love to 'deny' AAA in this market I suggest one thing, stop looking at ethnic lines and turn up the radio, perferably to 100.3 - Peace JG p.s. - Meems, am 'I high-income geeky professional type' - :-X I know I'm geeky, but, does that translate to high-income? Love you all at The Sound. Joe

 

[scooty430]

The problem with The Sound is they are playing too many familiar tracks you can hear elsewhere. From their log:

1:01pm - Burning Down The House (live) by Talking Heads wiki (JACK, KLOS)
1:06pm - Motivation by Sheryl Crow wiki (the old Star would have played it, or the old KBIG)
1:09pm - Alive And Kicking by Simple Minds wiki (JACK, KLOS)
1:14pm - Soul Meets Body by Death Cab For Cutie wiki (KROQ, Indie)
1:18pm - Sunset Grill by Don Henley wiki (JACK, KLOS, more?...)
1:25pm - Hard Sun by Eddie Vedder wiki (KROQ? New Star?)
1:29pm - Fool To Cry by Rolling Stones wiki (KLOS - though maybe too obscure for them now)
1:34pm - High And Dry by Radiohead wiki (KROQ, Indie, Star?)
1:38pm - Born On The Bayou by Ccr wiki (KRTH, KLOS, JACK)
1:43pm - Hello It's Me by Todd Rundgren wiki (KRTH, KLOS, KOST, JACK)
1:48pm - The Wrong Thing To Do by Mudcrutch wiki (KROQ, Indie, New Star)
1:52pm - Tainted Love by Soft Cell wiki (JACK, KROQ, MyFM)
1:56pm - Tangled Up In Blue by Bob Dylan wiki (KLOS

Some of these tracks are amazingly overplayed too. Sunset Grill, Bayou, Hello It's Me, Burning Down The House and Tainted Love are some perennial tracks people have been hearing nonstop for twenty years or more.

 

[SuperRadioFan]

Scooty, last week I did a quick look at Yes.com ("Top 100 songs")and KLOS, JACK, KROQ, and KYSR playlists. Its pretty ridiculous.... 40% of KLOS that's 40% I've heard on the Sound. JACK had around 36%, KYSR had around 30% and KROQ had around 22%. That's too much duplication!!

 

[djmimi]

well...they have to get their listeners from somewhere. We can't expect people to DROP their ipods!!!

hence, if they could just STEAL some listeners from another place (!) hmmm, just tryin to explain the duplication from other places...I could be totally wrong on that!

building up audience for a new station is a very tough and scary objective. esp in LA, where they generally don't budge.

 

[goriajk]

HI Meems...I don't know if you get a chance 'to slip in a song or two' during your morning shift, like when I heard a great song from Todd Rundgren while you were on the other day, it's all about research and marketing. In a city like ours KSWD has to compete with the other guys to gain market share, but when I read 40% of songs heard on KLOS are also heard on The Sound, it's all about gaining an audience and trying to keep that group (I believe KSWD is building a LOYAL audience and will stick around) I do get frustrated like SuperRadio when I have to hear something so ordinary... but, It's about building a station - esp. in a city so fragmented by other choices (KLOS, JACK, KROQ & KYSR) I notice one family member flipping between KSWD and KYSR, I asked him what's about 100.3 you don't like, his response "I like to channel flip - 98.7 plays Ozomatli that 'The Sound' doesn't play" You can't please everyone. What do you think, Mimi - Take care. I enjoyed listening to you yesterday - Keep up the good vibes. 8) Your friend - Joe

 

[SuperRadioFan]

well...they have to get their listeners from somewhere. We can't expect people to DROP their ipods!!!

hence, if they could just STEAL some listeners from another place (!) hmmm, just tryin to explain the duplication from other places...I could be totally wrong on that!

building up audience for a new station is a very tough and scary objective. esp in LA, where they generally don't budge.

Mimi I'm sure you've seen on the Sound Forum some ppl saying just that --- they have turned off their iPods (for a while) and yes The Sound has to steal listeners from those other stations. I myself have mentioned in the past that those stations' listeners are mostly what The Sound is targeting. In this order: KLOS, JACK, KYSR, KROQ, Indie, My104, KRTH, KTWV. My opinion.

Building an audience and cume is great for now, but lots of big fans of KSCA are disappointed to a certain extent and may not have the patience that this developing format seems to require.

I still have to listen to Radio Paradise to hear artists like Siouxie & The Banshees, Arcade Fire, Guided by Voices, Madelyn Peyroux, Arctic Monkees, and so many other indie-type artists plus lesser played cuts like Tangerine-Led Zep (which I just heard) and Life on Mars-David Bowie. I am very happy The Sound has added Airborne Toxic Event, and even pushed the envelope (for them) with The Ting Tings. Its a very careful balance the station is trying to do ... But they have just got to... got to .. minimize songs like Heartache Tonight-Eagles, anything by Bad Company <gasp!!>, just about any Cars song, half of Talking Heads songs (they're no longer that hip vibe of the KROQ of the 80s), most of the Police catalogue, a third of Pink Floyd stuff... Not enough time now to do a full critique but I hope you see the direction I think The Sound should take. I know its not up to you, Mimi, but we all hope Dave and Haley will seriously address these issues with the tired Classic Rock stuff. I don't mind the repetitions of currents, re-currents, and AAA-type artists/songs...THAT is why you build your cume, NOT by the classic rock stuff easily heard elsewhere...Why bother? We would hope 100.3 wants to be different!

 

[djmimi]

I think they do want to be different. They've actually been more responsive about the music than most stations! I hear changes almost daily. Programming a station is like steering the Titanic. YOu can only move one inch at a time. If you try to turn the wheel dramatically, you'll just end up capsizing the boat.

Besides where can you find a station where you've got the Eagles next to Death Cab next to Todd Rundgren next to Smashing Pumpkins next to Bob Marley...a most fun mix.

I'm just happy to be a part of it!
xoxo
meems

 

[scooty430]

I know you've been up in SF, but you can currently hear Eagles next to Todd Rundgren next to Smashing Pumpkins next to Bob Marley on both JACK and KLOS! (Only Death Cab, easily found on 98.7, KROQ, and Indie, is missing, using your example.)

So hearing super familiar, overplayed, heavily researched tracks from different radio formats is no longer thrilling. The JACK train-wreck novelty has worn off.

What would be exciting would be a station that hired some knowledgable DJs and let them spin tracks freely. Like Jonsey's Jukebox, but a little less bizarre, (though he'd be great in a night or weekend shift.) There needs to be something to attract people and get a buzz going, and that something is the personal connection with jocks and the music.

Yes, you'd scare away some casual folks, but you'd bring in a much more avid, loyal fan base who would spend more time with the station, and might even be a better demographic anyway. I get the sense that this is what The Sound is trying to court: real music fans who are devoted the way people were to KHJ, KMET, the old KROQ, or KSCA.

But you ain't gonna get that with safe tracks picked by a computer.

There are SO many musicians and industry people in LA with an incredible knowledge of music. We can handle, and perhaps we crave, a GOOD station that covers, as one station used to say, the "full spectrum" of rock and roll.

So......ditch the "Once In A Lifetime," "Roxanne," and corporate snooze-fest style and shake things up. You really have nothing to lose.

 

[SuperRadioFan]

I know you've been up in SF, but you can currently hear Eagles next to Todd Rundgren next to Smashing Pumpkins next to Bob Marley on both JACK and KLOS! (Only Death Cab, easily found on 98.7, KROQ, and Indie, is missing, using your example.)

So hearing super familiar, overplayed, heavily researched tracks from different radio formats is no longer thrilling. The JACK train-wreck novelty has worn off.

What would be exciting would be a station that hired some knowledgable DJs and let them spin tracks freely. Like Jonsey's Jukebox, but a little less bizarre, (though he'd be great in a night or weekend shift.) There needs to be something to attract people and get a buzz going, and that something is the personal connection with jocks and the music.

Yes, you'd scare away some casual folks, but you'd bring in a much more avid, loyal fan base who would spend more time with the station, and might even be a better demographic anyway. I get the sense that this is what The Sound is trying to court: real music fans who are devoted the way people were to KHJ, KMET, the old KROQ, or KSCA.

But you ain't gonna get that with safe tracks picked by a computer.

There are SO many musicians and industry people in LA with an incredible knowledge of music. We can handle, and perhaps we crave, a GOOD station that covers, as one station used to say, the "full spectrum" of rock and roll.

So......ditch the "Once In A Lifetime," "Roxanne," and corporate snooze-fest style and shake things up. You really have nothing to lose.

LOL!! Good points, though Mimi has been in SoCal for quite a while now...Her SF days were before KSCA I believe.

You know even knowledgable DJs (which The Sound seems to want) are handcuffed with the playlist determined by the MD, the PD, and the SBR consultant group. Though it would be nice to at least have the air talent during the shift assemble a few sets of songs that make sense rather than the mish mosh that characterizes the majority of AAA stations in 2008.

I thought about Jonesy's JukeBox that if/when Indie goes away, that Steve Jones can have a place or at least a specialty show on the weekends at 100.3.

I especially like your points about getting a "buzz" around town going and achieving an avid loyal fan base. Right now still lots of people are not aware of the station. The big billboards displaying "Now Playing" will help BUT they might hurt IF an iPod user spots the billboard and it displays "No One to Depend On"-Santana OR "BangAGong"-T Rex... two songs that were among the last ten songs played as I type this!! So what's going to grab that iPod user if he/she sees the same ol same ol???

When I attended The Sound's Meet Up last month, PD Dave Beasing asked the audience what ONE word describes The Sound. The first word that came to mind was "Safe" and as I blurted that out, MD Haley Jones looked incredulous and shocked at the same time. Sorry but they asked.... I know I'm not the only one who feels that way.

This wrap up thought of yours really needs to be repeated and driven home:

There are SO many musicians and industry people in LA with an incredible knowledge of music. We can handle, and perhaps we crave, a GOOD station that covers, as one station used to say, the "full spectrum" of rock and roll.

Too bad J.J. Jackson can't rise from the grave to give some guidance. But it is a good thing that they are trying to relate and serve their listeners. We want The Good Ship 100.3 steered a little quicker than The Titanic, otherwise The Sound might suffer the same fate as that big boat.

 

[scooty430]

That's funny. I thought Mimi Chen was up in San Fran. Has she been on the air down here since KSCA?

It's funny you highlight JJ Jackson. He's a good example of how you really need someone with a vision to make a station shine and be special. Those people almost always have a passion for music, combined with some business acumen and a willingness to take chances.

KHJ had Drake, KMET had Tom Donahue, KROQ had Rick Carroll.... You could even lump Mike Morrison in there.

Even the JACK fad, which was initially ridiculed by many in the radio industry, was started by one guy. Suddenly it's now OK to have a huge playlist. All industry "knowledge" went against that (and still does in many quarters.)

If you want to use movies or TV as an example, Seinfeld had Larry David, NYPD Blue had David Milch, and the Godfather had Coppola. All people who bucked the system in pursuit of their creative goals.

A committee, however, rarely produces anything exciting. Nor do focus groups.


.....Though I was on a plane once and read that the Olive Garden was the first restaurant created entirely by a focus group.

 

[ofthevoice]

The Olive Garden....nuf' said

 

[Indielover]

"There are SO many musicians and industry people in LA with an incredible knowledge of music. We can handle, and perhaps we crave, a GOOD station that covers, as one station used to say, the "full spectrum" of rock and roll"

While I think the sound is a good station, the station decribed in the above paragraph has been on the air in the LA area for almost 5 years now...indie 1031.

 

[ChannelFlipper]

They have definitely added safer album library cuts and more of them since the start. The playlist has degraded considerably since the first few weeks when this station was mandatory listening.

I disagreed with Super about the quantity and desirability of library cuts at the beginning - he said there were too many, I said I liked the fact that a lot of them were ones that don't get a lot of airplay, which made it much more interesting. But several stale Police, Cars and Eagles cuts later, and I now have come over to his side.

The problem is that they seem to be more interested in creating a mood/lifestyle station as opposed to a rock station with a personality. Some of the new cuts they play feel like they would be right at home on the Wave. So once you take these downtempo, quiet cuts and then intersperse them with predictable overplayed Peter Gabriel "In Your Eyes" type material, the station becomes quite bland. I don't expect the station to sound like KLOS, Indie, or KROQ, but it can have an adult attitude and still be interesting if it is done right.

In short if KSCA rocks (ed) harder than you do, you have a problem.

Give me a reason to tune in!!

PS - I do have one in Mimi, she is great and I am glad she is participating in the discussion. But the station has to be much more compelling than it is.

 

[scooty430]

"There are SO many musicians and industry people in LA with an incredible knowledge of music. We can handle, and perhaps we crave, a GOOD station that covers, as one station used to say, the "full spectrum" of rock and roll"

While I think the sound is a good station, the station decribed in the above paragraph has been on the air in the LA area for almost 5 years now...indie 1031.

Indie's great, and it really shouldn't change.

But it's focused mostly on new music (as it should be.) Its specialty programming is extremely niche-based, (alt-country, metal, etc.) This is also as it should be.

What we ALSO need is a station that plays music for people that like good stuff that goes back before the 80s, that hits a few genres that Indie avoids, and is a wee bit more mainstream.

There are four solid decades of rock (and rock related) music to draw on (50s, 60s, 70s, and 80s) plus a couple more that produced a little bit more good stuff (the last two decades.) Plenty of great music - thousands of strong tracks - to draw from. NO reason to play tired stuff.

Part of The Sound's mandate should be that they "play what other stations don't." That means no In Your Eyes, no Roxanne, no Take It Easy. Let someone else play that stuff; otherwise what is the point? Make that a huge selling point.

Then FORGET the silly research and get some solid, intuitive jocks and let them get inspired. Research = Movin'.

 

[Indielover]

"There are four solid decades of rock (and rock related) music to draw on (50s, 60s, 70s, and 80s) plus a couple more that produced a little bit more good stuff (the last two decades.) Plenty of great music - thousands of strong tracks - to draw from. NO reason to play tired stuff"

Indie plays and has always played music from all the decades...50's 60's and 70's mostly during specialty shows, also during regular format occasionally...Jonsey's Jukebox airing daily has featured all decades..especially 50's and 60's...Henry Rollins on Tuesday eve, features a very eclectic mix of very obscure music from all decades and genres. Watusi Rodeo on Sunday Morning features roots music (the roots of rock and roll), classic country and soul (some dating back to the 20's), to today's alt country....etc... etc...

I do agree with the poster who said (the sound) playlist has deteriorated from the early days of the station, to include many bland overplayed tracks...it's not a bad station overall, but the only station that truly plays the "full spectrum of rock and roll" is indie...

 

[scooty430]

Ahhh!

You're so busy defending Indie you're missing the point.

Indie's great, but there's room for TWO good stations on the dial!

 

[Indielover]

"What we ALSO need is a station that plays music for people that like good stuff that goes back before the 80s, that hits a few genres that Indie avoids, and is a wee bit more mainstream"

I wasn't trying to defend indie, rather I was making the point indie overall plays that "full spectrum of rock and roll" no other station ever will. Also in reference to the above quote, overall indie covers all decades quite well and plays many different genres.

I like the sound as well and hope it can survive...I fully understand what you would like "the sound" to be and that would be great, however it is doubtful it will be that...the day the sound began, Eduardo said it would have to be as familiar and mainstream as possible if it were to be successful..this is unfortunately probably true.

I fully agree that there is room for two great stations, and I continue to listen to and enjoy the sound, however for the full spectrum of music there is only indie...it is truly amazing it has survived almost 5 years. I believe the only reason indie has survived is because they simply don't know what else to do with the poor signals of the 1031's...that and the fact it does have a very loyal fanbase and is known and respected...I will continue to enjoy both indie and the sound...for as long as they last.

 

[scooty430]

I wanted to like The Sound. I really did. But it's becoming more like JACK and KLOS every day. And really, what is the point of that?

Oh wait. I know. Because "PPM favors classic rock."

They should probably abandon the "AAA" motif and just declare themselves "LA's BEST CLASSIC ROCK" or something. Lose the lofty "cool/hip MUSIC-FOCUSED station in town" goal and just go for a bold and crass grab at KLOS' and JACK's listeners, head to head.

 

[djmimi]

Ah, it all comes down to whether you believe in (1) Art vs. (2) getting ratings.

For any commercial station to survive, you need number (2.) No argument on that, right?

Tough love on (1) even tho' I enjoy the ART of being able to play the "uber" cool tracks and great music that aren't 'hits.' Many hits are burnt and crappy to listen to, but there are people (my brother included) who never listen and don't know who the Who or REM is. Yup, I've met a few. So they'll listen to the crispy critters without complaint. Remember, the ratings include the great unwashed segment of the population who aren't real music fanatics. So if you listen more than 15 minutes a day, you are doomed.

Over time tho, stations like WXRT, WMMR, KFOG who maintained the course of being on the edge, eventually win. I would be hopeful enough that it would be the classic case of tortoise vs hare. Question is, are they (sound management) gonna be THAT patient? Can they sell the station with their small, but dedicated audience (i.e. unimpressive ratings) and esp an even tougher than normal field of competitors?

Bonneville bought the station from Radio One, I heard the news of the deal late and am not intimate with details, but it sounded like a fire sale and (i think) they bought it cheap.
So they can plow mucho bucks into it and over the long run, if they sell the station, they can recoup their money many many times over. Of course, that is contingent upon the economy recovering from what is looking to me like a solid recession from whence there is no relief in sight. Not with the way oil prices are. I have friends in the bio-tech industry and have great hopes for an oil replacement from algae, but that will take several years. I have a bad feeling about the economy and changed my holdings, but the oil situation is not gonna change overnight. And it is affecting EVERYTHING.