WHERE ARE THE UNIONS?

[cm454]

Isn't there ANY way to get better representation in the midst of this industry-wide massacre?

I already know the answer: NO!

Way too many radio people are unfocused and incapable of realizing how important a UNION is at a time like this.

REMEMBER: Stations aren't cutting for survival, they are cutting to ensure that acceptable profits are made by shareholders. GROWING is always the mantra.

While understandable fluctuations of a profit margin are accepted by smaller outfits, they ARE NOT accepted by the big daddy's on Wall St.

There has rarely been such a NEED for UNIONS in this bizz as there is NOW!

You want to strip all of the entertainers from this dying industry?
Okay, let's see you operate with NOBODY. And I do mean NOBODY.

UNIONIZE.

And I don't mean the poor excuse for a union that exists today. AFTRA may as well not even exist at this point. What a joke.

 

[nmoore6676]

Unions in all industries became an anachronism once all of the original issues, safety, hours and wages, which caused them to be born were resolved. Now they are merely dues collecting ineffective shells whereby the elected officers live off the proceeds of the members labor.

 

[calguy]

KOST, KIIS, KBIG and the AM CC stations in Burbank are union, but CC is ignoring them. They have little power.

 

[nmoore6676]

Not likely that AFTRA has done or will do anything for Clear Channel to ignore. The there is the consideration that since the radio business is an ever shrinking close knit environment the talent may not wish to be see as rabble rousers. If they were to initiate any sort of protest it could make their chances of future employment opportunities difficult.

AFTRA like all other unions make closed shop environments where to work you have to join and then they sit back and let the dues payments roll in.

 

[mred]

most of the kfi crowd was anti-union anyway - so who cares about them

 

[cm454]

EXCUSES.

That is what I expected.

The fact is, the ONLY time a union typically allows such a drastic de-emphasizing of the unionized workforce, is when it is necessary for the SURVIVAL of a company---and still then they go kicking and screaming.

Is this about survival of a company or an attempt to get closer to the unrealistic profit projections promised to Wall St?

If radio people weren't so selfish and disorganized, there WOULD be an effective union that would have the capability of inflicting GREAT PAIN upon these companies for the $hit that they pull.

A lot of these cuts around the country wouln't even have been considered if there had been a union worthy of being feared.

Radio people are getting what they deserve for such a degree of apathy and ignorance of the coming tidal wave of de-emphasis. The clock was ticking ever since Clinton signed Telecom 11 years ago, and radio people are no more prepared now than they were then.

Typical.

 

[Radioboy989]

AFTRA has had a long time to become stronger. They didn't. If they had worked on unionizing at least the top 50 markets, many places where CC has any real earning potential would likely be harder for them to crack. The strength of a union is in NUMBERS. AFTRA has ignored potential membership outside of major markets IMO.

 

[RBA]

Unions can't organize a satellite and automated computer system. Circuits don't need health care.

 

[brifi8500]

The radio workforce was caught with their pants down. By the time it became apparent that downsizing was going to systematically reduce the workforce by significant percentages, people had become far more paranoid and consumed with saving their own butt---not organizing in an efforrt to slow or stop the bleeding.

So many have been terminated and had their duties delegated to others at this point, that there is no longer any real threat of a mass walkout.

Nicely done.

I can't even begin to tell you how high the percentage is of people I've worked with over the years, who had such little insight, knowledge or even concern for the immediate, not to mention long term state of this industry.

The average radio person has been painfully ignorant of some of the most important issues facing this ndustry, especially as it relates to AIR PEOPLE. For that reason, I am not entirely sympathetic to a large portion of the displaced masses. Like lambs to slaughter, predictably, they didn't even see it coming.

 

[Shoot From Hip]

At the end of the day, it's hard to identify a company (especially a radio company) that will bargain away something it chooses not to, so blaming AFTRA probably isn't going to get you anywhere. And it's not just CC. Look at the situation with CBS and the Writers Guild (no contract for three years, and now the threat of a walkout). Besides, many of the AFTRANS let go by CC this week were working with personal services contracts and being paid overscale, so the collective bargaining agreement wouldn't apply anyway. BRIFI8500 is right...what's happening in radio right now is much larger than a simply issue of failure to organize. There is structural change occurring in radio at every level. And the result is that senior management is simply giving local managers math problems to solve...and those math problems (i.e. "here are your new expense budgets; you figure out how to achieve them") are what's creating the staffing cuts, shift extensions and voicetracking options. Add to that the change in the way ratings are determined (through the passive measurement system), and you see a broader story. And by the way-- word is the changes aren't limited to the air product. I'm hearing that CC sales people are taking a haircut in the form of reduced commissions next year as well.

 

[KFodor]

AFTRA has had a long time to become stronger. They didn't. If they had worked on unionizing at least the top 50 markets, many places where CC has any real earning potential would likely be harder for them to crack. The strength of a union is in NUMBERS. AFTRA has ignored potential membership outside of major markets IMO.

My one experience with AFTRA in my career (not in LA, but in another market quite a while ago), had to make me wonder about what the employees really got by unionizing.

Admittedly, I was management, but also on the air so I had to be a "provisional" member of AFTRA. But, when I finally was shown the contract (which took an act of Congress to get to see), I was shocked. The "scale" pay was as much as $100 a week or more less than what other stations in the market were paying. The "scale" pay for a newsperson was, in my view, unlivable in that particular market and I was embarassed when I could only offer a quality person "scale", due to union regulations.

The upsides to the contract? A 38 hour work week, no work requirement on holidays and fairly decent pay if...you were lucky enough to have had about 10 years of service with the station at the time the agreement was written. Otherwise, one would have had to work at that station at least 5 or 6 years before the pay raises began to make your salary competitive with other stations in the market.

I'm not against unions, per se...but in my humble opinion...those particular employees were crazy to have approved that deal.

 

[Big E]

The biggest reason I cant stand unions, is that they keep people at positions, that they no longer deserve to hold, just because they paid their dues.

 

[Julius Leonard Marx]

Yes, union leadership are often parasites concerned about their jobs, not your's. Nobody has ever confused unions with democracies.

Most air talent in LA have contracts and a few better deal than the union contract provides for. Unions are irrelevant to them (and to the highly paid movie and TV writers now striking).

The people in radio who need unions are those in small and medium markets, and the unions can't be bothered with them.

 

[kyscott]

Yes, union leadership are often parasites concerned about their jobs, not your's. Nobody has ever confused unions with democracies.

Most air talent in LA have contracts and a few better deal than the union contract provides for. Unions are irrelevant to them (and to the highly paid movie and TV writers now striking).

The people in radio who need unions are those in small and medium markets, and the unions can't be bothered with them.

Why do you need a union? Are you unable to negotiate your salary with station managment?

 

[RicoGregg]

Why do you need a union? Are you unable to negotiate your salary with station managment?

With all due respect to Mr. kyscott....

In 1987, I naively took a job at a major, prestigious L.A. station. I was to start as a board operator for the station's Transtar programming at night, and also do some call screening and producing for the post-game talk show during baseball season. I was to have weekends off. I was started at $8.00 an hour. I was excited, enthusiastic, and optimistic that it would turn into something better as time went on. The station back then was known for employing people for ages.

Then came the end of baseball season. The station decided to put local air talent on instead of the Transtar programming. Suddenly, I was doing studio work for college and pro football games. I also did early Sunday morning board-opping for the FM sister station for their Rock version of Transtar programming. All in the confines of a weekend. My sleep habits got erratic, and my pay, with the reduced hours, remained at $8.00 an hour.

Station management changed the FM format several times, so as a result, my hours fluctuated. I experienced a few 60+ hour weeks, including a 21 and a half hour day, and then there'd be 16 hour weeks. I worked every holiday, when the station would turn into a ghost town. And, I remained at $8 an hour. I should also mention that there was no paid vacation, no sick leave, and after I had been there for 3 years, still naively thinking that I was paying my dues, management stopped it's matching contributions to the savings & investment plan.

When the Operations Director or one of the Production Directors went on vacation, I often filled in, and the extra money (still $8 an hour) came in very handy, but I mostly struggled. A couple of times I took on a second job during the week, but more often than not, the station Ops Director would call me at the other job, asking me to come in either that night or the next day. The bosses at the other jobs didn't much care for that.

I always looked forward to the start of each baseball season. That meant more money (still at $8 an hour) and a semi-livable wage. I had a very small but cheap apartment in the Echo Park area, near Dodger Stadium. I couldn't afford that apartment today because Echo Park has lately become an "In" place with writers, artists and even a few producers, and rents have skyrocketed. Not even at $8 an hour.

Then things really went South....

While trying to save money by smoking a very cheap, generic cigarette instead of my usual brand, I got into an uncontrollable coughing fit at the station. I could not stop coughing to save my life. A co-worker called the paramedics, and I was taken to a nearby hospital. I was later told that my skin, brown in hue, turned milky white. The coughing got so bad that it reached the point where I didn't care if I lived or not, I just wanted the coughing to stop. The ER doctors were able to stop the coughing, and I wound up resting for an hour or so at the hospital. I was then sent home with a $1200 bill. I also wound up with a very high temperature, and I was unable to work for two weeks. My immediate supervisor, the AM Ops Director, a really good man, tried to get the General Manager to give me a little sick leave money, and told him what happened. The GM just shrugged his shoulders and told my boss that that was my problem. I tried going into work a couple of times, but I just couldn't do anything. I was always sent home.

After nearly 3 and a half years of making $8 an hour, with no benefits or perks, I finally asked myself that if I'm working at this prestigious L.A. station, where the hell was the money? I spent all that time watching just about every other employee go on vacation. I approached the GM's assistant and asked for a meeting with him. She coldly asked me what it was regarding, and I told her that I wanted to discuss a pay raise. She gave me a dirty look and said that the GM doesn't like being bothered with matters like that, but she'd take my request to him.

The next day that I worked, I was called into my boss' office. I was told that the GM was pissed about my having the nerve to approach him for a raise, and that my request for a meeting was denied. I was no longer going to work during the week during baseball season. Now, I'm being permanently assigned to weekends, no matter what, still at $8 an hour. A little while later, I'm whittled down to one day a week. Then 4 hours. Then, I was completely out. No "you're fired", just "We'll call you and let you know." That was early 1991. I'm still waiting for that call.

That particular station used to be represented by NABET in addition to AFTRA. NABET had been gone from there for some time.

So, after all that, do you think that I could have could have used some union representation? Uh, yeah, I think so.

To answer Mr. kyscott's final question, I was unable to negotiate my salary with station management. Not when station management didn't feel like negotiating salary with me.

Last item: I'm still friendly with the Ops Director from that time. He's out of radio now, and just about ready for retirement. He told me that I was a good employee, had a good attitude and work ethic, and that I never caused any problems. It was just that my timing was bad. I worked there when the station had horrible management.

 

[Big E]

$8 in 1987? I started at $8 in 1997! Why did you wait so long to ask for a raise? Why didnt you leave? I know the feeling of being passed up for positions, but I also new it was my own fault for not pursuing my goals much harder. Once I realized that things werent gonna get handed to me, I put my nose to the grind stone. Dont know if anyone in here is a fan of Larry Elder, but one thing he preaches rings true in this situation. Dont blame anyone but yourself for your misfortunes.

 

[Julius Leonard Marx]

Yes, union leadership are often parasites concerned about their jobs, not your's. Nobody has ever confused unions with democracies.

Most air talent in LA have contracts and a few better deal than the union contract provides for. Unions are irrelevant to them (and to the highly paid movie and TV writers now striking).

The people in radio who need unions are those in small and medium markets, and the unions can't be bothered with them.

Why do you need a union? Are you unable to negotiate your salary with station managment?

It's what you call "your money or your life" kind of negotiation. Unless somebody is a "name," they really have no bargaining position. A big reason why radio has moved away from "personalities" is to have on-air employees who are interchangeable, replaceable and easily fired.

It continues to amaze me how radio treats employees like dirt, those employees defend management's right to do so and bash denounce unions. Instead most people get out of the biz before they are 30, after either getting fired or realizing that as long as they stay in radio they will never be able to afford to move out of their parents' basement.

There is a lot wrong with how unions operate but how else can workers respond effectively to bad treatment? If anybody has a better idea, let's hear it.

 

[Shoot From Hip]

Here's a puzzle for everyone to solve:

You own a business in an industry that, across the country, is generating less money than it was five years ago...and is generally expected to have another "down" year in 2008. At the same time, your costs are going up due to a variety of contractual obligations: rent/lease, utilities (especially energy costs), required employee raises, the cost of acquiring and training for evolving technologies, government-required upgrades (i.e. "HD"), marketplace competition that is resulting in audience attrition across the country, demands from your advertisers that you embrace new (and much more expensive) measurement services, increased costs for marketing your own product.

How do you change your business model so that you're going to end up with more money at the end of the coming year than you generated this year?

 

[RicoGregg]

$8 in 1987? I started at $8 in 1997! Why did you wait so long to ask for a raise? Why didnt you leave?

In 1987, I had already been in radio nearly 2 decades. When I was hired at this station, I was going to be working with some of radio's biggest names, and the station had a longtime prestigious standing. Most people who worked there had been there for many years. It was almost like being told "OK, pal, do a good job for us, and you've got a job for life." That's the kind of place it was. Because of all that, I didn't want to rock any boats. I actually liked working there, and wanted to stay there forever.

At most places I had worked at before, I didn't have to ask for a raise. It was usually automatic after one year of employment. At one place, it was after 3 months.

I don't know where you are, Big E, but it obviously isn't Los Angeles, one of the most expensive cities to live in. I was very lucky to find the cheap apartment in Echo Park back then. It wasn't advertised anywhere, as real bargains often are not. A friend told me about it. In this past Sunday's L.A. Times, you can find Rooms For Rent listed at $1500 and up.

I know the feeling of being passed up for positions, but I also new it was my own fault for not pursuing my goals much harder. Once I realized that things werent gonna get handed to me, I put my nose to the grind stone.

I had had enough experience in the biz by then to realize that things weren't going to get handed to me before I started working there. I did everything they asked, including working a six week period in early 1988 without a day off. That period also included the aforementioned 21 and a half hour workday.

Dont blame anyone but yourself for your misfortunes.

Anybody in my position at the time would have thought that working there would be great, and that it would turn into something better as time went on. That normally happens with elongated employment at one place.

After I left, this same GM fired a 33-year employee by having a secretary leave a note on his typewriter in his office, while he was out to lunch on a Friday, telling him not to come in the following Monday. Was that misfortune the employee's fault?

 

[RicoGregg]

Unless somebody is a "name," they really have no bargaining position. A big reason why radio has moved away from "personalities" is to have on-air employees who are interchangeable, replaceable and easily fired.

It continues to amaze me how radio treats employees like dirt, those employees defend management's right to do so and bash denounce unions.

There is a lot wrong with how unions operate but how else can workers respond effectively to bad treatment? If anybody has a better idea, let's hear it.

Truer words were never spoken.