INDIANAPOLIS SEPTEMBER PPM

[shawk-n-awe]

Dharry - You're only half right. Yes radio stations have the same number of listeners as they had before. Your analogy between KM and miles is not accurate though. KM can be accurately converted to miles. PPM to diary not so much. PPM is measuring exactly what the person carrying the device is actually exposed to, while diary measured what the listener thought they listened to. Your analogy would be more accurately stated as it's the difference in measuring driving distance by your odometer (PPM) or by how far you thought you drove (diary).

The big problem is the number of meters in in the marketplace. Indy is scheduled to have 1,000 meters per book. That's one meterper 1,660-ish people.

 

[PTBoardOp94]

And that compares how with the number of diaries per book? I'd guess 2500 or so for Indy? Realizing that the panelist model for the PPM intentionally has fewer participants than the diary.

 

[Dingy Harry]

Shock-n-Awe... I am humbled. Your analogy was better than mine.

PTBO - There are fewer people in the total PPM vs diary. PPM is around a thousand. Diary was over 2000. It will be interesting to watch though. In diary there were 2000+ participants divided by 12 weeks. So the weekly sample was only 166+ people. Because they panel participate for a longer period of time there are 1000 panelists every week.

 

[radio_radio]

http://www.sandwelltrends.info/lisv...e_to_sampling_and_statistical_reliability.pdf


This is a fairly interesting read on sample size reliabilty. It bascially says that 1067 panelists will give you a +/- 3% confidence level against most population sizes. Sooner or later you have to deal with the law of diminishing returns and cost of the methodology.

 

[orangeradio]

Am I correct, the people in Madison county still can't receive Indianapolis stations ? If so, will they ever invent radios that can pick up 50,000 watters all the way, (15 minutes) up I-69 ?

 

[butlerguy03]

Am I correct, the people in Madison county still can't receive Indianapolis stations ? If so, will they ever invent radios that can pick up 50,000 watters all the way, (15 minutes) up I-69 ?

I wish Madison County was included in one of the markets...seems like everyone thinks we can't listen to Muncie or Indy market radio.

 

[BobOnTheJob]

It would make sense for Anderson to be in the Muncie Market as all counties in the Indy Metro actually border Marion County. It's in the best interest of all the Class A Indy stations (WHHH, WTLC, WNOU, WKLU..etc) that Madison county not be a part of Indy's book as none of them reach there well enough to show.

 

[kd8hho]

It would make sense for Anderson to be in the Muncie Market as all counties in the Indy Metro actually border Marion County. It's in the best interest of all the Class A Indy stations (WHHH, WTLC, WNOU, WKLU..etc) that Madison county not be a part of Indy's book as none of them reach there well enough to show.

but i can pick up ibc, fbq,fms,zpl,rzx, and several others (and i can pick up NOU and TLC from north anderson)

Considering more people in Anderson listen to indy radio over muncie radio.

 

[orangeradio]

The point being, Madison County should be counted in the Indy survey. If Chicago, Columbus, Muncie, etc. show up -- Madison county not being included, makes it a bogus survey.

 

[radio_radio]

The point being, Madison County should be counted in the Indy survey. If Chicago, Columbus, Muncie, etc. show up -- Madison county not being included, makes it a bogus survey.

Please explain further your point about how Madison County not being part of the Indianapolis Metro area makes it a bogus survey. Additionally tell us how Chicago, Columbus and Muncie appearing in the Indy Metro survey figures in. I just want to see your logic.

 

[cold_coffee]

Okay! Let's apply some simple logic here. You are in 5th grade math class. You apply 2 different methods
and come up with entirely different numbers when the sum should have been the same answer.

Either one or both of your methods is flawed! Are we smarter than a 5th Grader?

How many radio stations have died because of this? How many people have been fired? The ratings
game is what has killed the creativity that drew us all to radio in the first place causing broadcasters
to play it safe with programing.

The real killer of good radio is now exposed. Are we smarter than a 5th grader?

 

[shawk-n-awe]

http://www.sandwelltrends.info/lisv...e_to_sampling_and_statistical_reliability.pdf


This is a fairly interesting read on sample size reliabilty. It bascially says that 1067 panelists will give you a +/- 3% confidence level against most population sizes. Sooner or later you have to deal with the law of diminishing returns and cost of the methodology.

But, I believe in order for this to be true in a random sample, you have to have nearly 100% acceptance form the chosen sample. i.e. for the sample to really be random and reliable, almost every person you ask to participate must accept the invitation. This is one reason many statisticians won't endorse Arbitron's methodology.

 

[radio_radio]

http://www.sandwelltrends.info/lisv...e_to_sampling_and_statistical_reliability.pdf


This is a fairly interesting read on sample size reliabilty. It bascially says that 1067 panelists will give you a +/- 3% confidence level against most population sizes. Sooner or later you have to deal with the law of diminishing returns and cost of the methodology.

But, I believe in order for this to be true in a random sample, you have to have nearly 100% acceptance form the chosen sample. i.e. for the sample to really be random and reliable, almost every person you ask to participate must accept the invitation. This is one reason many statisticians won't endorse Arbitron's methodology.

Then explain when I say "not interested in participating" to a political poll how that differs from your 100% acceptance theory. If I am reading you correctly, all surveys cannot be endorsed by statisticians as you never get 100% acceptance from all chosen. In my example...I was chosen, but I said I didn't want to participate in the poll.

 

[Onesimus]

I think Bob Neil at Cox Media had a good idea when he suggested that Arbitron use a cellphone as a PPM device. Wouldn't it be better if we gave the panel a "free" cell-phone that tracked their listening habits?

 

[BobOnTheJob]

I think Bob Neil at Cox Media had a good idea when he suggested that Arbitron use a cellphone as a PPM device. Wouldn't it be better if we gave the panel a "free" cell-phone that tracked their listening habits?

Brilliant idea! That would allow for a larger pool & also allow their habits to be tracked long term. I'd do that for a free Verizon cell phone, but wouldn't for a Sprint or one of the other brands that only work in big cities or along the Interstate.

 

[cold_coffee]

In some other countries they have a much more accurate method of determining what you are
listening to. Detection vehicles drive through the streets of towns detecting the local oscillator
of peoples radios. This tells the authorities what you are really listening to.

In the UK you pay for a license for your radio. They use this method to find unlicensed receivers.
In some countries you are busted for listening to illegal broadcasts this way.

At least this method tells the truth. The American system is flawed and has killed good radio stations
and caused talented people to be fired by BS ratings.

 

[PTBoardOp94]

But I'm pretty sure, under any method of survey, K-Love has higher ratings than Oldies 101.9

 

[cold_coffee]

Nope. 105.7 came way up using the new method. Oldies 101.9 would have done much better as well.

 

[Mid West Clubber]

How can you be busted for listening to an unlicensed broadcast, especially since Lodon has so many.. How are regular people going to know if a station is licesed or not?

 

[mouseman]

Nope. 105.7 came way up using the new method. Oldies 101.9 would have done much better as well.

Now Russ, er - Cold Coffee Me thinks you protest too much.

If you honestly believed PPM methodology would have shown a dramatic improvement for Oldies 101.9, you would have held on until the later half of this year [instead of selling] to enjoy the windfall of revenue those higher ratings would generate. I appreciate your optimism for the Oldies format, but I think in your heart-of-hearts you knew PPM ratings weren't going to be a windfall and, therefore, ultimately accepted the "bird in hand" [i.e. EMF check in hand].