La Preciosa se va

[Robert Bass]

Come on Robert ... some formats do well in the PPM world and others do not. We have always programmed to the ratings service. Stopsets at :07, :22, :37 and :52 to get that coveted 5 minutes for a quarter-hour credit. PPM is going to change many things. Programming will have to adjust. Sales will have a new fight on their hands with agencies attempting to strongarm stations on the GRP issues and <gasp> posting. JD is doing what is best for his cluster to keep S.A. happy (can't say that I agree with the zero-cost growth BS on a personal level). LaP was a good idea ... CC just did not have the cost-efficient capability to counter-program. They had a few good months of billing. And there was a small bit of local content. The bottom line is that I am not surprised with the decision to re-format KEGL.

Like any of the local stations, the struggle is ongoing. KHKS makes money based on the morning show (the other dayparts do their best to stay in the top 10); KDMX struggles, both ratings and billing-wise. KDGE has their own set of problems that are too numerous to go in to. KZPS ... well, don't get me started. Bo and Jim were shut down (read muzzled) many moons ago and are a shell of their former selves. TTN does well though. With 1 or 2 reps they post consistent dollars.

Having played this game for many more years than I care to admit, I think that I have a pretty good feel for how commercial radio has evolved and where it is going.

Let me put it this way... Where is the term "diary friendly" for the present diary reporting system?

Sure some formats may do better than others, but that's no reason to call 'em "diary" or "PPM" friendly, as each format doesn't do the same in their respective markets.

R

 

[CCEX]

Are you serious? Most, if not all programmers HAVE to play to the diary system. The ratings monopoly Arbitron created this monster. Paper diaries for now and electronic measurement in the future. Certain stations and formats are more diary-friendly than others. When PPM comes into play in a year or two, stations/formats will need to become PPM-friendly. Some will and some will not. There are 40+ metro stations in DFW. One-third are Spanish-language. Few will succeed in the PPM world. Urban stations will experience similar issues. Mainstream formats, A/C, Rock, CHR will enjoy the largest gains. Cumes will increase and TSL will decrease. That's just how it is. Urban and Hispanic listeners will not have the luxury of padding listening in the paper diary. Fact of life. As radio professionals we will adjust. Electronic measurement is coming, like it or not. Pager-like devices, cell phones, whatever, will bring in a new era of listening estimates. As broadcasters we have no choicce but to adjust. KHKS will exceed one-million in cume. KDMX and KDGE will come close. Since there is no real rock station in DFW, flipping KEGL to rock makes all of the sense in the world. Properly promoted and marketed they too can close in on the magical million cume.

 

[VERITAS DE VOCE]

Ah... harp music playing reflective tunes ...how I long for the days in radio when AQH, CUME, AMD and even good ol' POST were more than acceptible terms to throw around like you knew something. But no... now we have HD, IBOC and friggin' dawn-of-the-CONsultants' treasured "PPM" to keep up with.

Shoot, I quit. I'm going to back to Whataburger and make shakes!

 

[little1]

Let me put it this way... Where is the term "diary friendly" for the present diary reporting system?

Sure some formats may do better than others, but that's no reason to call 'em "diary" or "PPM" friendly, as each format doesn't do the same in their respective markets.

R

Actually, a lot of the older women skewing stations have long been considered
"diary friendly", as those women are more likely to participate in the survey and keep the diary. Remmeber that Arbitron pays a higher 'fee' to young men, minorities, etc, because those groups haven't been diary friendly, and they've had to pay more in their 'honorarium' to try and up participation.

Because remember that the less particpation, the more they weigh each diary. The greater the weighing, the more likely you are to have greater fluctuations....To try and put it simply- if Arbitron is trying for 50 diarys in a given cell, and they get less than that back, they have to give more credit to the dirays they do receive- in other words, those 30 diarys that they do get are multiplied up to fill what should be 50.

 

[CCEX]

I understand diary-weighting and demo premiums (I worked for the ratings giant for several years). With return rates under 30%, many more diaries have to be sent to reach the 4,000+ number every quarter. Young males are highly recruited and been for many years. This issue has carried over to the PPM markets as well. It will not go away until Arbitron can create a system that appeals to the younger demo.

The consultants were around long ago. I was fortunate to work for a monster station at one time where we chose our music, jocks had complete control of what went out over the air and the consultant merely kept track of the rotation. A medium market 30 share gave us the leverage to cancel Arbitron and pretty much own the market. The business has changed in 30 years ... music directors set the playlist days in advance, touch screens have replaced cart machines and don't even get me started on voice tracking.

 

[Robert Bass]

Are you serious? Most, if not all programmers HAVE to play to the diary system. The ratings monopoly Arbitron created this monster. Paper diaries for now and electronic measurement in the future. Certain stations and formats are more diary-friendly than others. When PPM comes into play in a year or two, stations/formats will need to become PPM-friendly. Some will and some will not. There are 40+ metro stations in DFW. One-third are Spanish-language. Few will succeed in the PPM world. Urban stations will experience similar issues. Mainstream formats, A/C, Rock, CHR will enjoy the largest gains. Cumes will increase and TSL will decrease. That's just how it is. Urban and Hispanic listeners will not have the luxury of padding listening in the paper diary. Fact of life. As radio professionals we will adjust. Electronic measurement is coming, like it or not. Pager-like devices, cell phones, whatever, will bring in a new era of listening estimates. As broadcasters we have no choicce but to adjust. KHKS will exceed one-million in cume. KDMX and KDGE will come close. Since there is no real rock station in DFW, flipping KEGL to rock makes all of the sense in the world. Properly promoted and marketed they too can close in on the magical million cume.

No offense CCEX, but you're getting a bit off topic. Sure, Arbitron data itself is relevant. BUT, calling formats "Diary / PPM Friendly" has no meaning. Zero, ziltch, nada.

That's like saying format x ranks #1 in market A while the same format ranks at or below #12 in market B, means both formats are PPM or diary friendly. THAT is what makes those types of terms irrelevant. It's utter nonsense. For that to be true, then format x would have to be highly ranked in a good majority of the major markets, to even consider calling it "PPM / Diary Friendly".

I am not dismissing the form, approach or meaning of Arbitron data, I am merely saying inappropriate terminology is being used.

It's a technicality, so to speak.

R

 

[thathoustonradiogeek]

Back on topic: It seems that the Preciosa format just simply moved to... Orlando, Florida of all places, replacing Sports at CC's WQTM 740 Tomorrow, or so the rumor says...



http://www.radio-info.com/smf/index.php/topic,87068.0.html

 

[davideduardo]

Back on topic: It seems that the Preciosa format just simply moved to... Orlando, Florida of all places, replacing Sports at CC's WQTM 740 Tomorrow, or so the rumor says...

I'm sure the Puerto Ricans, who make up 92% of the Hispanic population of Orlando will just adore that...

 

[davideduardo]

When PPM comes into play in a year or two, stations/formats will need to become PPM-friendly. Some will and some will not. There are 40+ metro stations in DFW. One-third are Spanish-language. Few will succeed in the PPM world. Urban stations will experience similar issues. Mainstream formats, A/C, Rock, CHR will enjoy the largest gains.

Gainers are AC, classic hits, rock variants. CHR in Houston and PHilly is off or flat. Spanish, in Houston, had 19.5 shares in the last diary book. It has 19.7 in the PPM, so Hispanic stations will stay the same or increase where the sample is properly balanced and proportional (Houston is not balanced and proportional, but is closer than the abortion that is PPM in NY)

There are 84 stations licenced in the Dallas metro, 68 of which are commercial. There are now 14 Spanish langauge stations, or about 20% of the total. Of the FMs, only 2 cover the market, and only one of the AMs.

Cumes will increase and TSL will decrease.

But 92% of listening will be done by less than half the cume. The rest of the cume is useless, and simply drags down the TSL. But shares stay relatively similar.

That's just how it is. Urban and Hispanic listeners will not have the luxury of padding listening in the paper diary.

As evidenced in Houston, the amount of Hispanic listening is constant between the to methodologies. Black station listening is off 20%.

Fact of life. As radio professionals we will adjust. Electronic measurement is coming, like it or not. Pager-like devices, cell phones, whatever, will bring in a new era of listening estimates. As broadcasters we have no choicce but to adjust. KHKS will exceed one-million in cume. KDMX and KDGE will come close. Since there is no real rock station in DFW, flipping KEGL to rock makes all of the sense in the world. Properly promoted and marketed they too can close in on the magical million cume.

In general terms, male-skewed stations are PPM friendly, while female oriented ones are diary friendly since in the PPM shows about 20% less listening by females overall. AM is diary friendly except for pbp sports. Rock is PPM friendly, while AC is neutral, as are Hispanic formats.

For those that don¿t understand the "friendly" term, all it means is that the particular ratings methodology favors or disfavors a format when compared with the other method. Same thing was seen in Pulse vs. Arbitron or Birch vs. Arbitron.

 

[davideduardo]

No offense CCEX, but you're getting a bit off topic. Sure, Arbitron data itself is relevant. BUT, calling formats "Diary / PPM Friendly" has no meaning. Zero, ziltch, nada.

Formats that do better in PPM than the diary are PPM friendly... ones that do better in the diary than the PPM are diary friendly.

We have been using the same comparison with Arbitron vs. Hooper, Arbitron vs. The Pulse and Arbitron vs. Birch. Certain formats performed better in one method than the other. Beautiful music was diary friendly, AOR was Birch friendly.

We've been using the "friendly" term for 40 years.

 

[van hespen]

Ah..the memory of Birch. Yes, their telephone methodology was much more friendly to men (18-34). Its hard to fill out a diary with a beer in your hand.

Gotta run, the phone is ringing.

 

[CW]

TAKE THAT MR. B! You've been butt slammed!!!! weeenie and the butt in the mornings ;D

On 97.1 FM.....weenie and the butt!! In the mornings....oh yeah!!! 97.1!!!!! FM in the morning, with weenie and the butt...97.1...(where's that look from Cleveland when you need him? Oh thats just nasty!)

 

[MikeShannon914]

Any allusion to Kidd's old "Burn Your Buns" intended there? ;D

"W&tB" sounds like a great candidate for 105.3.

 

[Slambang]

Yes, who'd love to suffer from all day Weenie & The Butt...sadly, someone at CC prolly will re-steal that from Seth McFarland and try to package it as a real product

 

[VERITAS DE VOCE]

Hmmm... what took more brains?

Weenie and the Butt or Radio Jihad ???

I would lean on the cracked crew that hired this tandem. Oy!

 

[Robert Bass]

Sounds a little "fishy" to mean. Wait a minute, now I'm thinking of all the commercial possiblities. I see BASS-FM being aired on the all-aquarium cable tv station. The fish would be schwimmin'!

Yeeah, but only until the CONsultant sharks arrive.

R

 

[Robert Bass]

New from Oscar Meyer: Weenie and the Butt hot dog... Available at a grocery store near you.

"Ethel... I told ya, I want yellow mustard with that!"

R

 

[CCEX]

Back on topic, I just knew that David Eduardo would chime in on the thread. David, I am well aware of the number of stations that are permitted to call DFW home.

Houston has a larger Hispanic population (30.1% vs. 23.9%), therefore the numbers will reflect the 25% difference.

CC and CBS will continue to duke it out in DFW. CC is preparing for the PPM rollout (look for a 2009 start as I doubt that Arbitron will institute the late 2008 date that has been announced for the market). Having researched, sold and programmed DFW stations for a few decades, I feel somewhat qualified to share an educated opinion from time to time.

We have a long way to go with electronic measurement. This week is, I'm sure, one of many advisory council meetings on the subject. The 60% or so increases in ratings costs are already changing the horizon of local radio. The coveted double check mark means a lot to Arbitron. MCR accreditation is the proverbial gold star that Arbitron needs to justify their rate increase.

Yes, there are diary-friendly formats and PPM-friendly formats. Stations will tweak, if not change, formats to do what is best for their station, cluster and the almighty shareholder. Fact of life my friends.

Good luck and happy holidays.

 

[fredthehead]

YELLOW MUSTARD! and I thought you didn't have a sense of humor Bass!

Where's DIngo and the Baby firing hot dogs into the bimbo's mouth when you need 'em

I hope this PPM stuff works and points out to all the folks that work in radio that medium does suck really really really bad and the industry desperatley needs to change....

Anyone know how the sales of HD radio are doing? I mean why would I want free radio between stations on the dial? WHa'ts the sales pitch? "MOre crap you don't want to listen to, between the crap that is already there"? I don't get the marketing strategy

 

[davideduardo]

I hope this PPM stuff works and points out to all the folks that work in radio that medium does suck really really really bad and the industry desperatley needs to change....

Why would the PPM show that radio "sucks?" It, in fact, actually shows quite the contrary.