Jhani Kaye Leaving KRTH/KTWV

[oldies76]

Either play the appropriate years or rename the channels!

The point is you're programming a radio station, not taking a history test.

The POINT is that if the station is a 50's channel, you play 50's music, period! Not a song from 1963. Many times I've heard 1980 or 1969 music on the 70's channel thru direct TV.

 

[oldies76]

Nobody wants to play 60's songs today, as the demo those tunes appeals to has no sales appeal. In fact, most classic hits stations have nearly eliminated the 60's songs save for those that got extensive play into the late 70's as gold on CHR stations.

Please mention that to KRTH, last I checked they play from two to four 60's hits per HOUR.

Also many stations still have specialties that feature hits from 1967 to 1969, including WCBS.

I agree that 60's music is unfortunately slowly dwindling, but it's not gone yet and won't be for some time.

 

[radio-darn]

The POINT is that if the station is a 50's channel, you play 50's music, period! Not a song from 1963. Many times I've heard 1980 or 1969 music on the 70's channel thru direct TV.

A lot of early 60's tunes - pre-British invasion - were cut from the same cloth as 50's hits and the average person accepts that it is music of an era that did not end just because the calendar changed from 1959 to 1960. Most listeners really could not even tell you the year most songs were released and don't care: it's the sound they like, not the publishing date.

It's the same for all eras: music perfectly compatible with the 70's was in fact released in 1969 and 1980 and even before and after those dates.

As someone who was a radio music director in the 70's for MOR and TOP 40 stations and very familiar with music from the 40's, 50's and 60's I can tell you I too was pretty anal about this issue when I first got XM radio and heard those 50's tunes on the 40's station. When I voiced my concern about that my wife rolled her eyes and said something along the lines of "much ado about nothing."

We radio people get hung up on technical details that don't matter to listeners, such as the alphabet soup of radio formats and what should and should not be played on them. Whenever I have asked someone what kind of music they like, no one ever replied, "CHR," or 'AOR," or "Hot AC." They might say "dance music," or "rock" or "oldies," or "rap," or other such terms that are much more generic than what radio geeks would use. And if they like Dion singing "A Teenager in Love" from 1959, they have no problem hearing the same station playing his 1961 hit "Runaround Sue."

 

[Thomps2525]

In the 1970s top-40 stations played John Denver, Neil Diamond, Barry Manilow, Tom Jones, Barbra Streisand, Anne Murray, Engelbert Humperdinck and the Carpenters.

In the 1970s MOR stations played John Denver, Neil Diamond, Barry Manilow, Tom Jones, Barbra Streisand, Anne Murray, Engelbert Humperdinck and the Carpenters.

Radio-darn must have had an easy time as a programmer. But in the 2010s it seems that hardly anystation of any format will play those artists. How and why did AC programmers decide that listeners no longer want to hear those artists?

 

[michael hagerty]

In the 1970s top-40 stations played John Denver, Neil Diamond, Barry Manilow, Tom Jones, Barbra Streisand, Anne Murray, Engelbert Humperdinck and the Carpenters.

In the 1970s MOR stations played John Denver, Neil Diamond, Barry Manilow, Tom Jones, Barbra Streisand, Anne Murray, Engelbert Humperdinck and the Carpenters.

But in the 2010s it seems that hardly anystation of any format will play those artists. How and why did AC programmers decide that listeners no longer want to hear those artists?

I can't believe I have to say this.

Steve: They tested the artists and their records. The listeners told them. Probably some time in the 90s when the currents were by groups like Third Eye Blind, which doesn't necessarily flow well with the artists mentioned above.

Rule one for any format that bases any significant part of its appeal on current music: In a conflict between your currents and your golds, your currents win and you adjust your golds.

 

[TheBigA]

The equivalent is playing is playing Al Jolson on Boss Radio in the 60s. Was Jolly getting airplay anyplace in the 60s?

 

[oldies76]

In the 1970s top-40 stations played John Denver, Neil Diamond, Barry Manilow, Tom Jones, Barbra Streisand, Anne Murray, Engelbert Humperdinck and the Carpenters.

In the 1970s MOR stations played John Denver, Neil Diamond, Barry Manilow, Tom Jones, Barbra Streisand, Anne Murray, Engelbert Humperdinck and the Carpenters.

But in the 2010s it seems that hardly anystation of any format will play those artists. How and why did AC programmers decide that listeners no longer want to hear those artists?

I can't believe I have to say this.

Steve: They tested the artists and their records. The listeners told them. Probably some time in the 90s when the currents were by groups like Third Eye Blind, which doesn't necessarily flow well with the artists mentioned above.

Rule one for any format that bases any significant part of its appeal on current music: In a conflict between your currents and your golds, your currents win and you adjust your golds.

I believe LARadioRewind is referring to classic hits stations not playing those groups mentioned. Obviously Top 40 radio in the 90's or today would not play those artists as golds.

 

[davideduardo]

Nobody wants to play 60's songs today, as the demo those tunes appeals to has no sales appeal. In fact, most classic hits stations have nearly eliminated the 60's songs save for those that got extensive play into the late 70's as gold on CHR stations.

Please mention that to KRTH, last I checked they play from two to four 60's hits per

Check my post again. I said that, except for the 60's songs that were heavily played in the 70's, nobody wants anything to do with the 60's as that era appeals principally to those out of the sales demos.

My belief is that, if the KRTH format endures in LA, it will be increasingly 70's and 80's if it is to survive.

Next time you listen, pay particular attention to the spots. I think you will find that nearly all come from local, regional or national agency accounts.

 

[davideduardo]

In the 1970s top-40 stations played John Denver, Neil Diamond, Barry Manilow, Tom Jones, Barbra Streisand, Anne Murray, Engelbert Humperdinck and the Carpenters.

In the 1970s MOR stations played John Denver, Neil Diamond, Barry Manilow, Tom Jones, Barbra Streisand, Anne Murray, Engelbert Humperdinck and the Carpenters.

But in the 2010s it seems that hardly anystation of any format will play those artists. How and why did AC programmers decide that listeners no longer want to hear those artists?

I can't believe I have to say this.

Steve: They tested the artists and their records. The listeners told them. Probably some time in the 90s when the currents were by groups like Third Eye Blind, which doesn't necessarily flow well with the artists mentioned above.

Rule one for any format that bases any significant part of its appeal on current music: In a conflict between your currents and your golds, your currents win and you adjust your golds.

I believe LARadioRewind is referring to classic hits stations not playing those groups mentioned. Obviously Top 40 radio in the 90's or today would not play those artists as golds.

No, he clearly asked about AC stationary.

 

[radio124]

In the last commercial break on KRTH, there were 11 spots. I heard commercials/psas for Arizona State University, Mike Diamond Plumbing, CA Lottery, Albertsons, Toyota Dealers, 1-800 Got Junk,McDonalds, Optima Tax Relief, CA Exempt Bonds, Toys r Us, and Walgreens. I assume all of these were agency spots. Which of these could appeal to a 55+ audience?

1. ASU. Probably not.
2. Mike Diamond probably doesn't care if you are 28 or 68 as long as you call him when your toilet gets clogged.
3. Ca lottery probably doen't care how old you are as long as you buy their tickets.
4. Dittos on Albertson's. 55+ has to eat and if the food quality is good and the market is convenient they will shop there.
5. Toyota Dealers most likely aiming for the under 55. Although Toyota has been around for so long I'm sure many 55+ are buying their cars.
6.1-800 Got Junk wants your junk whether you're 8 or 80.
7. McDonalds wants you to buy their Big Macs whether you are 17 or 77. They have been around so long and have a large appeal to the 55+ demos. I see many seniors when I go in a Mcdonalds.
8. Optima Tax Relief. Seniors get audited as well as young people. So this seems to be a service that could appeal to 55+
9. Ca Exempt Bonds. Seems like a 55+ ad to me. I don't know too many young people buying bonds.
10. Toys r Us. Grandparents shop there for their grandchildren.
11. Walgreens. 55+ need to buy deodorant, tootpaste and get prescriptions filled. They will shop at a store that is convenient to their location.

 

[michael hagerty]

Yep. But they all play under 55, too. Even the bonds. Anyone serious about investing for retirement (or for their kids' educations) needs to start way sooner than 55.

 

[davideduardo]

In the last commercial break on KRTH, there were 11 spots. I heard commercials/psas for Arizona State University, Mike Diamond Plumbing, CA Lottery, Albertsons, Toyota Dealers, 1-800 Got Junk,McDonalds, Optima Tax Relief, CA Exempt Bonds, Toys r Us, and Walgreens. I assume all of these were agency spots. Which of these could appeal to a 55+ audience?

1. ASU. Probably not.
2. Mike Diamond probably doesn't care if you are 28 or 68 as long as you call him when your toilet gets clogged.
3. Ca lottery probably doen't care how old you are as long as you buy their tickets.
4. Dittos on Albertson's. 55+ has to eat and if the food quality is good and the market is convenient they will shop there.
5. Toyota Dealers most likely aiming for the under 55. Although Toyota has been around for so long I'm sure many 55+ are buying their cars.
6.1-800 Got Junk wants your junk whether you're 8 or 80.
7. McDonalds wants you to buy their Big Macs whether you are 17 or 77. They have been around so long and have a large appeal to the 55+ demos. I see many seniors when I go in a Mcdonalds.
8. Optima Tax Relief. Seniors get audited as well as young people. So this seems to be a service that could appeal to 55+
9. Ca Exempt Bonds. Seems like a 55+ ad to me. I don't know too many young people buying bonds.
10. Toys r Us. Grandparents shop there for their grandchildren.
11. Walgreens. 55+ need to buy deodorant, tootpaste and get prescriptions filled. They will shop at a store that is convenient to their location.

.

Not a one of those accounts asked for rates against anything other than some part of 25-54.

As an example, the Lottery knows who buys the most tickets...and it is not 55 and over.

Albertsons knows who buys the most food with the biggest marks... It is usuall couples where both work and who buy lots of convenience items

McDonald's definitely knows that seniors are a bad proposition, ROI wise. The probably have among the biggest "no geezer" dictates of all.

Likewise, at best none of these would shun seniors as customers, but the buys we're most assuredly no priced and placed with any 55+ in mind.

 

[davideduardo]

In the last commercial break on KRTH, there were 11 spots. I heard commercials/psas for Arizona State University, Mike Diamond Plumbing, CA Lottery, Albertsons, Toyota Dealers, 1-800 Got Junk,McDonalds, Optima Tax Relief, CA Exempt Bonds, Toys r Us, and Walgreens. I assume all of these were agency spots. Which of these could appeal to a 55+ audience?

1. ASU. Probably not.
2. Mike Diamond probably doesn't care if you are 28 or 68 as long as you call him when your toilet gets clogged.
3. Ca lottery probably doen't care how old you are as long as you buy their tickets.
4. Dittos on Albertson's. 55+ has to eat and if the food quality is good and the market is convenient they will shop there.
5. Toyota Dealers most likely aiming for the under 55. Although Toyota has been around for so long I'm sure many 55+ are buying their cars.
6.1-800 Got Junk wants your junk whether you're 8 or 80.
7. McDonalds wants you to buy their Big Macs whether you are 17 or 77. They have been around so long and have a large appeal to the 55+ demos. I see many seniors when I go in a Mcdonalds.
8. Optima Tax Relief. Seniors get audited as well as young people. So this seems to be a service that could appeal to 55+
9. Ca Exempt Bonds. Seems like a 55+ ad to me. I don't know too many young people buying bonds.
10. Toys r Us. Grandparents shop there for their grandchildren.
11. Walgreens. 55+ need to buy deodorant, tootpaste and get prescriptions filled. They will shop at a store that is convenient to their location.

.

Not a one of those accounts asked for rates against anything other than some part of 25-54.

As an example, the Lottery knows who buys the most tickets...and it is not 55 and over.

Albertsons knows who buys the most food with the biggest marks... It is usuall couples where both work and who buy lots of convenience items

McDonald's definitely knows that seniors are a bad proposition, ROI wise. The probably have among the biggest "no geezer" dictates of all.

Likewise, at best none of these would shun seniors as customers, but the buys we're most assuredly no priced and placed with any 55+ in mind.

 

[LKellerIII]

In the last commercial break on KRTH, there were 11 spots. I heard commercials/psas for Arizona State University, Mike Diamond Plumbing, CA Lottery, Albertsons, Toyota Dealers, 1-800 Got Junk,McDonalds, Optima Tax Relief, CA Exempt Bonds, Toys r Us, and Walgreens. I assume all of these were agency spots. Which of these could appeal to a 55+ audience?

1. ASU. Probably not.
2. Mike Diamond probably doesn't care if you are 28 or 68 as long as you call him when your toilet gets clogged.
3. Ca lottery probably doen't care how old you are as long as you buy their tickets.
4. Dittos on Albertson's. 55+ has to eat and if the food quality is good and the market is convenient they will shop there.
5. Toyota Dealers most likely aiming for the under 55. Although Toyota has been around for so long I'm sure many 55+ are buying their cars.
6.1-800 Got Junk wants your junk whether you're 8 or 80.
7. McDonalds wants you to buy their Big Macs whether you are 17 or 77. They have been around so long and have a large appeal to the 55+ demos. I see many seniors when I go in a Mcdonalds.
8. Optima Tax Relief. Seniors get audited as well as young people. So this seems to be a service that could appeal to 55+
9. Ca Exempt Bonds. Seems like a 55+ ad to me. I don't know too many young people buying bonds.
10. Toys r Us. Grandparents shop there for their grandchildren.
11. Walgreens. 55+ need to buy deodorant, tootpaste and get prescriptions filled. They will shop at a store that is convenient to their location.

.

Not a one of those accounts asked for rates against anything other than some part of 25-54.

As an example, the Lottery knows who buys the most tickets...and it is not 55 and over.

Albertsons knows who buys the most food with the biggest marks... It is usuall couples where both work and who buy lots of convenience items

McDonald's definitely knows that seniors are a bad proposition, ROI wise. The probabtly have among the biggest "no geezer" dictates of all.

Likewise, at best none of these would shun seniors as customers, but the buys we're most assuredly no priced and placed with any 55+ in mind.

He's got a point. I'm 61 - I rarely buy lottery tickets. I own an '09 Toyota but I bought it used from a private party and saved a lot of money over a dealership. While we shop at Safeway (all the Albertson's around here were bought out by Lucky), 80 percent of our food budget is spent at Costco, Trader Joe's, and local produce markets.

There are about a dozen Walgreen's convenient to my home, but I buy my prescriptions online from CVS because my health insurance gives me a discount. We get deodorant and toothpaste at Costco. Yes - you have to buy a half dozen of each, but for some reason, they don't spoil in the drawer ;D

Like most people my age with grown kids - I have no grandchildren. Most 20 somethings are waiting until they're in their 30s to have kids these days. And all the Toys R Us stores in the
Bay Area have closed anyway.

McDonalds? Please. When my grown kids were young, we would take them in for a fast food fix about once a week. My youngest (now 17) was shown Supersize Me in 5th grade. She'd sooner gouge her eyes out than buy a Big Mac. I was really hungry about a month ago, and in a moment of weakness, bought a Cheddar Somethinorother Burger at a Mickey D's. It tasted like cheese covered dirt.

Probably the biggest danger lurking for 25-40 year old consumer spending in this country during the coming decade will be student loan debt, which will soon be larger than credit card debt.

Maybe then we over 55s will get some respect from advertisers!

 

[TheBigA]

Maybe then we over 55s will get some respect from advertisers!

The question you need to ask is why should an advertiser, ANY advertiser, spend money on a radio station that attracts an audience predisposed not to respond to advertising.

 

[LKellerIII]

Maybe then we over 55s will get some respect from advertisers!

The question you need to ask is why should an advertiser, ANY advertiser, spend money on a radio station that attracts an audience predisposed not to respond to advertising.

...I was joking. I don't require any "respect" from advertisers, nor do I want any.

 

[TheBigA]

...I was joking. I don't require any "respect" from advertisers, nor do I want any.

But you'd obviously like them to continue supporting the oldies format on the radio, right?

 

[Thomps2525]

I'm impressed that somebody actually sat through an entire commercial break on KRTH. No matter what station I'm listening to, I change the channel as soon as the first commercial starts.

Michael, yes, I know that most programmers no longer play what their "gut instinct" tells them is right. They hire consultants and conduct auditorium tests and do call-out research. But all the adult-oriented 1970s artists that I named (Murray, Manilow, Denver, Diamond, Carpenters, et al) are getting very little airplay in 2013 on any station in any format. If I was programming a station, I'd play all those artists just because nobody else is. I refuse to believe that those artists no longer have any fans.

Lew, I don't think advertisers necessarily respect listeners---they respect profits. (I can hear David Eduardo always working on a response to that assertion! )

 

[michael hagerty]

Michael, yes, I know that most programmers no longer play what their "gut instinct" tells them is right. They hire consultants and conduct auditorium tests and do call-out research. But all the adult-oriented 1970s artists that I named (Murray, Manilow, Denver, Diamond, Carpenters, et al) are getting very little airplay in 2013 on any station in any format. If I was programming a station, I'd play all those artists just because nobody else is. I refuse to believe that those artists no longer have any fans.

Nobody says they don't have any fans, Steve. But the number of fans still in the desirable demo versus the number of people in the desirable demo who either don't want to hear them or don't care if they do is the issue. And what those songs would do to the overall flow of the music.

 

[Biondi4Mayor]

Is now a good time to mention I heard "Rainy Days and Mondays" not too long ago on WOMC-Detroit? Either Detroit just remembered they really love the Carpenters enough for them to "test well" or that was some skewed-lousy research. I've never heard them played regularly on any Classic Hits station, and low and behold, there they were - in Detroit of all places.